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The colour is determined by handful of genes, which determin the distribution of pigment in the dog's hair. Are you suggesting that the same genes also affect the dog's temperament?

Lida







LOL, obviously I didn't make myself clear enough,so for that I apologise.Yes I do believe that the genes that affect colour will also affect temperment.

I'm assuming that everybody who keeps and rears animals are well aware of how an animal is reared and raised will influence it's temperment,colour plays a part too.

Below is an extract I've copied from the gerbils forum,where the owner posted it.I know him personally,and appreciate the trouble he takes in finding information for us,and translating it into understandable jargon.

Coat colour is a small but fascinating part of the story of domestication and behaviour. Links between coat colour and temperament have been found in many diverse species, for eg, light colour fallow deer become tamer than those with wild type colouration. Black cats overall tend to be more placid than wild-type agoutis, It was noticed that black cats were commonly more found in cities while agoutis were more common on farms. Colour and temperament are also linked in foxes too, foxes of differing colours display different levels of fearfullness towards humans. Depigmentation can also greatly affect temperament. Pigment cells are found in the skin and at the base of hairs, here they produce pigment that colours the fur. However pigment cells and pigments aren't just found in the skin, they are also found in the brain, these include regions that are related to mood and stress.

This link between coat colour and temperament stems from a relationship between pigment production, hormones, and neurochemistry. In particular, the hormones and neurotransmitters involved in the stress response and other behaviours are closely related to pigment production. An example of this is the neurotransmitter dopamine and the hormones noradrenaline and adrenaline, which are involved in the stress response, have the same biochemical precursor as the melanin pigments. In addition to this dopamine influences pigment production by binding itself to the pigment producing cells. Dopamine indirectly influences pigment production by inhibiting pituitary melanotropin , which is responsible for stimulating pigment cells to produce pigment.

By breeding only the tamest and most docile animals in a group, we select for physiological changes in the animals hormonal and neurochemical systems, changes that impact morphology and physiology, which includes fur colour. A change in fur colouring during domestication may therefore be an incidental byproduct of selection for tameness.

The agouti or wild type colour is also strongly linked to temperament. Agouti animals have a tiny molecule that switches pigment production between light and dark pigment on a single hair as it grows, this creates the banding. Non-agouti animals lack this tiny molecule, so their hair is dark. This molecule is known as the agouti protein and is also found in the brain, here it blocks neurochemicals known to have strong effects on behaviour and physiology. Agouti animals have different neural profiles of neurotransmitters involved in stress( catecholamines) and larger adrenal glands (which produce stress hormones) than non agouti animals. Relationships between nonagouti or black colouration and docility has been found in several species including foxes, rats, and deemice.

Biological relationships between temperament and coat colour may therefore be one of the historical reasons that black and piebald colourations are so much more common in domestic animals than in their wild counterparts.

Hope you've enjoyed reading it :) .

Lyd
 
Lydia said:
The colour is determined by handful of genes, which determin the distribution of pigment in the dog's hair. Are you suggesting that the same genes also affect the dog's temperament?

Lida

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Biological relationships between temperament and coat colour may therefore be one of the historical reasons that black and piebald colourations are so much more common in domestic animals than in their wild counterparts.

Lyd

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I would like to know who is the author of this scientific paper and where it was published.

 

As far as the reason why there is more domesticated piebald animals than wild ones, it is simple ; we humans like these colours and selectively breed for them. I n wild preditor who does not blend into the environment has it considerably harder to get his prey. While the prey is more likely to survive if it is also not very noticeble.

The question is; does this article actually prove that blonds are indeed dopier? 8)

Lida
 
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Agouti animals have different neural profiles of neurotransmitters involved in stress( catecholamines) and larger adrenal glands (which produce stress hormones) than non agouti animals. Relationships between nonagouti or black colouration and docility has been found in several species including foxes, rats, and deemice.
Isn't this exactly opposite to what was said above = the black (blue) being totally mad?

While someone else, further back, thinks the fawns are the bullies.

Lida
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The question is; does this article actually prove that blonds are indeed dopier? 8)

Lida







So you're a blonde then :thumbsup:

Lyd
 
Thanks for that article Lyd. Very interesting and makes a lot of sense of something I read recently about silver foxes at a Russian fur farm. About 10% of the foxes were less fearful or aggressive than the rest and as foxes are hard to manage, these foxes were bred from in an attempt to produce tamer foxes. Apparently it took 18 generations but these foxes were more like domestic dogs in behaviour and the vixens came into season twice a year. The downside was that they were often piebald which was no good to a fur farm. The colour came from selecting solely for tameness - the piebald coat was definitely not selected for.
 
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Hi Judy,

There is another,longer article.That one does have refernces to the scientists involved.I haven't got around to digging them up yet myself,but as dogs were also tested,it is my intention at some point to study it more.

Piebald genes seem to be the ones to appear first,certainly with wild animals,maybe not piebald genes exactly,but white appears which through selective breeding seems to take over.

Shame it become so prominant at the fox fur farm.Did they try culling the ones with white,to produce tame silver foxes with out white ?

Lyd
 
Colour=temperament

It is almost impossible to assess the perceived relationship between colour and temperament. To start with it is the owner’s OPINION of their dogs and it would be very difficult to categorise in scientific way. And is the dog “mad” because his owners are incapable of discipline him or because of a bad temperament?

Far from being proven it continues to be subject of scientific and philosophical debates all over the world, with many theories on the subject of nature versus nurture, and what makes an individual what he /she is. While there is a possibility that the agouti protein does have some effect on the brain, I doubt it is so strong that we can say that each colour has a different temperament. In any case Whippets do not carry this gene.

The fact is that puppies are born with definite personalities, but I have often seen them change dramatically as they grow.

My last year’s litter of Whippets is a perfect example; 6 solid fawns, 3 boys, 3 girls. 4 blue masked, 1 girl and 1 boy with black masks. They all had distinct temperaments to start with. The black masked girl was a real little hyperactive devil; I had dozens of pics of 5 puppies and a red smudge. I really did not want to keep her; I had my eye on the sweet blue masked one. But the red one won in the end and that is my Callista. She is now 11 months old and is one of the easiest and most obedient dogs I ever had. On the other hand the most placid pup from that litter was a big blue masked boy. He came back to us few weeks later for 3 weeks, while his owners were overseas, and he was a big bully with the other pups – I ran on 4 of them for a long time, not being able to make my mind which to keep. The third girl was the most destructive pup I had ever raised, I warned her new owners and waited with abated breath terrified she will be returned to me. When, in couple of weeks I received a call from them, my heart skipped a beat. But guess what, I was told she is an angel, so well behaved, in the couple of weeks chewed up only one, insignificant object, goes to obedience classes where she excels.

So, how does this fit with the theory of colour gene controlling temperament? Well, to start with the article says that it is the agouti gene that can have an effect on the brain. Not all breeds of dogs have this gene. The article says that absence of the agouti gene makes the animal dark (black), what it means that it would be the blacks (blues) that ought to be tame. How does it fit with the pale deer that suppose to tame easier?

Actually, absence of agouti gene means that the animal will not have banded hair; it can be dark (black) or light (fawn, cream).

Every individual gets half of his genes from his mother and half from his father; these genes will determine the colour, shape, size and up to a point the temperament. So if you have, lets say a particolour dog with lovely temperament; his progeny is likely to be both particolour and have a good temperament. Especially, if you line breed to this dog. THAT DOES NOT necessarily MEAN THERE IS A CONNECTION between the colour and temperament. The pied is recessive to solid colours and in wild is (for what ever reason) rare. That means both parents have to have this gene to get pied offspring. In the fox program in Siberia obviously at least one of their foundation foxes had the pied gene, and in one point two foxes carrying this gene were mated and the pied started popping up.

Lida
 
moriarte said:
Do people think that the various colours have distinct temperaments? The lady I know with the 2 Nimrodels says the fawn is a right little bully to the very sweet brindle one.
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I have two fawns, one is a real thug and the other is really sweet.
 
Here we go again on color :rant: :rant: :rant:

Does it matter? Apart from the fact all whippets should be 40% white mixed with any other color :- " :- "

So I say "no comment". :huggles: :cheers:
 
Lol at Cartman, as for Seraphina,you've really missed the point on these discussions haven't you.Have actually decided you're dumber than a blonde,but what the hell.I offered some information,that mentions colour also playing a part in temperment.I've never claimed that colour alone determines how a dog's temperment will be.

I personally suspect that the tests involving dogs would have been the hardest to do,and maybe the least accurate,due to their close relationship with us for many yrs.

As I haven't read the paper,concerning the test that were done with the dogs,I will be better informed to form an opinion,once I've read them.

Lyd
 
Lydia said:
.Have actually decided you're dumber than a blonde,Lyd

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No need for that kind of comment Lyd, really. Think it, but don't type it mate, - it's inflammatory. The first sentence would have been enough. ;)

Dignified debate is what we want, isn't it, to keep k9 a happy place?
 
Lydia said:
Lol at Cartman, as for Seraphina,you've really missed the point on these discussions haven't you.Have actually decided you're dumber than a blonde,but what the hell.I offered some information,that mentions colour also playing a part in temperment.I've never claimed that colour alone determines how a dog's temperment will be.I personally suspect that the tests involving dogs would have been the hardest to do,and maybe the least accurate,due to their close relationship with us for many yrs.

As I haven't read the paper,concerning the test that were done with the dogs,I will be better informed to form an opinion,once I've read them.

Lyd

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Lydia;

your actual words ; "yes,colour does affect temperment.It has also been proven scientifically" is what I objected to. I think you are the one missing the point. Opinion by one anonymous person is hardly scientific evidence.

Lida
 
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