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Heart Murmur And Enlarged

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kevin earl

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hi all

just an update on our whippet since the cruciate last xmas , leg has healed ok without surgery so looks good , but he had to have a tooth out as it was bad earlier in the year and also at that time the heart murmur came up again at the vets who said it was enlarged after an x ray , the tooth was causing mucus in the nose but after that when he was put on the vetmedin tabs the mucus never went away at all and has got worse over the last few weeks , he hardly goes a night without the snot build up , took him today to vets and we said about the tabs and said we did not give him them for 3 days and the mucus cleared up , started him after 3 days and its back , told vet we will try him off the tabs for 7 days as i think the vetmedin are causing mucus in the nasal passage and giving him serious breathing problems he agreed but keep an eye on him , has anyone heard of the side effects like this? also spoke to mary lowe about him as he is her breed and she said again vets dont know what they are talking about with whippet murmurs!!
 
kevin earl said:
hi alljust an update on our whippet since the cruciate last xmas , leg has healed ok without surgery so looks good , but he had to have a tooth out as it was bad earlier in the year and also at that time the heart murmur came up again at the vets who said it was enlarged after an x ray , the tooth was causing mucus in the nose but after that when he was put on the vetmedin tabs the mucus never went away at all and has got worse over the last few weeks , he hardly goes a night without the snot build up , took him today to vets and we said about the tabs and said we did not give him them for 3 days and the mucus cleared up , started him after 3 days and its back , told vet we will try him off the tabs for 7 days as i think the vetmedin are causing mucus in the nasal passage and giving him serious breathing problems  he agreed but keep an eye on him , has anyone heard of the side effects like this? also spoke to mary lowe about him as he is her breed and she said again vets dont know what they are talking about with whippet murmurs!!

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Personally I would be guided by your vet, if you are not happy you can always get a second opinion.

If an xray showed a problem you just cannot ignore that, regardless of what his breeder says.

Do you know if the mucus build up is a side effect of vetmedin. I have used it on one of mine with no problems.

It is a shame when a breeder doesn't give any advice.
 
Just looked up Vetmedin, it says the only known side effect is that it might cause vomiting, so I should think the the mucus has another cause, you need to insist your vet does something about it.
 
I would go to a specialist cardiologist and even better if you could find one who has experience with sighthounds.

Having recently had our bitches extensively heart tested we had to do a lot of our own research into what is "the norm" for whippets as their heart is very different to most dogs.

If you would like any info, feel free to get in touch :thumbsup:
 
kevin earl said:
hi alljust an update on our whippet since the cruciate last xmas , leg has healed ok without surgery so looks good , but he had to have a tooth out as it was bad earlier in the year and also at that time the heart murmur came up again at the vets who said it was enlarged after an x ray , the tooth was causing mucus in the nose but after that when he was put on the vetmedin tabs the mucus never went away at all and has got worse over the last few weeks , he hardly goes a night without the snot build up , took him today to vets and we said about the tabs and said we did not give him them for 3 days and the mucus cleared up , started him after 3 days and its back , told vet we will try him off the tabs for 7 days as i think the vetmedin are causing mucus in the nasal passage and giving him serious breathing problems  he agreed but keep an eye on him , has anyone heard of the side effects like this? also spoke to mary lowe about him as he is her breed and she said again vets dont know what they are talking about with whippet murmurs!!

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Hi Kevin

Has your dog got any symptoms of a heart murmur or enlarged heart? I've just lost a whippet who was almost 16. She was diagnosed with a heart murmur at least 5-6 years ago - but my vet said not to treat it unless we saw symptoms eg coughing, breathlessness, fluid retention etc. She had a series of stokes 3 years ago, and was put on Vivitonin. After that she never had another stroke. She was put to sleep 3 weeks ago because her liver was failing - she would have been 16 in February. She never had any heart medication, and never needed any. I'm told a lot of vets say a whippets heart is enlarged, but that it is normal in a running dog, as it's a muscle much like the other muscles they have which are bigger than most other breeds. I know you should be guided by your vet, but in my experience, sometimes you know better whether drugs are affecting them. I worked for a vet who told me one of my other whippets had a heart murmur when she was 5 - the nurses in the practice used to joke that he had a heart murmur in his stethoscope because he was always hearing murmurs. She went on to race until she was 10, and at 8 years old was the top pedigree veteran bitch. Mary Lowe is no doubt right, that the mojority of pet vets don't know what is normal for a whippet. Unless any of my dogs had signs of a heart problem, I would never give them medication.
 
Personally i would go back to your vet and as you say the dog is having breathing problems too. Whippets can suffer from Rhinitis which is an immune condition and difficult to sort out

If you want the information for NORMAL hearts in whippets then pm Rachael ( Ris22 ) who has replied in this thread im sure she will email the info and you can take this to your vet, jan
 
hi all

thanks for the replies on the issue , he does have breathing probs at the moment and its very nasal ie noisy but as i said until he was on vetmedin we did not have any probs so who knows eh
 
If you read the thread properly you will see an xray has been done and it shows the heart is enlarged.

Obviously if that is the problem as your vet has told you, the vetmedin should help, but the mucus must have another cause. As stated rhinitis is something whippets can suffer with, does your whippet wheeze at all?

I would imagine this is a pretty thorough vet, but if in doubt seek a second opinion, you are allowed to do that. Your vet must be able to point you in the direction of a cardiologist vet.
 
bertha said:
If you read the thread properly you will see an xray has been done and it shows the heart is enlarged.

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The point people are trying to make is; is the heart enlarged in opinion of somebody who knows what is normal for a Whippet, or is it an opinion of a pet vet who does not know?

I would take the x-rays and go for a second or even 3rd opinion.
 
hi again

had him back tonight again and vet has given him antibis as it is not chest its nasal area , and if the x ray shows enlarged that might not be the cause and everyone should read the article that was done about heart murmurs etc , rachel from citycroft e mailed me with it and its very very good reading and also very informative and i have to agree vets are not so sure about whippets as all opinions from vet to vet differ a lot, thanks for all the replies so far
 
I work at a vets and we don't use vetmedin until they ar showing clinical signs of heary disease eg exercise intolerance, breathlessness. Many dogs have murmurs all their lives without clinical signs. Depends on severity of the murmur too, has the vet told you what grade murmur it is? Somene I know it regularly doing agility with a dog with a grade 4 murmur, as he has no signs at the moment.

If you are unsure would definitely get referred to cardiologist, there are manyall over the country and tis is their specialist field so will know more. Have never known vetmedin to cause mucus as already started sounds more like rhinitis or possibly an infection eg aspergillus, a swab may be helpful or a nasal wash to determine if inflammatory or infective.
 
There will be good veterinary cardiologists (and radiologists) at both Glasgow and Edinburgh vet schools who will be able to evaluate the degree of enlargement and whether it's within normal limits for the breed or is bigger than it should be - and if there are other changes in the chest.

but

a tooth root abscess can cause a nasal discharge.... which doesn't necessarily have anything to do with the heart. I'm not clear from the OP what the tooth pathology was?
 
hi

thanks for all the views on this, but my belief is that he did have a bad tooth , only one and was no abcess when they removed it but was black , but the point i was making is that my dog has never shown signs of not wanting to go for a run and never has since a pup and i have to say that since he was put on vetmedin he had had more problems than ever in his 8 years , we were never at the vets hardly other than a small temp , but in a year we have been over a dozen times , coincidence or what everyone has to make a call on what they think , but i am still open to other views the heart murmur but vets maybe dont see enough sighthounds
 
He is eight, which in some dogs depending on their make up is getting on a bit! Some remain youthful to the end, others age more quickly!

Get a second opinion on the heart, find out about rhinitis, I believe that is the way to go IMO!

Vemedin is a safe drug and should not make your dog ill.
 
One of my whippets ( a rescue ) has a snotty nose and this is a permanent thing .

This has been thoroughly investigated and various drugs have been tried but nothing made any difference . As she is a rescued dog and I didn't get her until she was 8 I don't know when it started .

So the vetmedin may or may not have anything to do with the snotty nose
 
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