Bwra Agm

[hellbound]

just wondering steve bell proposed another class for the bigguns 48/50,i seconded it,was it voted on,steve would like to know as he hasnt a computer?????????

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anybody know

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what was the proposal David ...

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an extra class to acomadate the bigguns 48+

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Dave the proposal that steve put in was said to be not workable it would mean another class and another trophy :wacko: so did'nt go out to the members vote,

the bwra now have to work out what they are going to do with the new weight they have set and the dogs that can still run as no limit, will that mean another trophy

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b4.......36lb 40lb no limit = 3 classes

now......36lb 40lb 55lb = 3 classes... no extra trophy needed

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So what you are saying is Dave and Steve's proposal of an extra class was found unworkable because of the cost of another trophy for how many events a year 8 or so ... surely if members where approached people would of sponsored trophy's to cover these opens .... lol

But the proposal of splitting the puppy and yearling scr into 3 classes instead of one was found workable thats an extra 4 trophy's a year

Can not believe that was the reason for not adding another class ..

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think it was also pointed out that it would just make people breed bigger no limit :wacko: and they want that stopped

 

[hellbound]

YOUR A REP WHY CANT I ASK YOU

GARY 

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well as i understand as a rep if your pup's breeding is greyhound to cross whippet / greyhound then no you can't reg it next year any that are already on the card will run

 

[gary farmer]

OK THANKS THEN I NEED TO GET A PETITION GOING TO OVERTURN THIS STUPID RULING DOGS ALREADY BORN SHOULD BE ABLE TO RUN

SHE HAS BEEN TRAILING AT THE CLUB FOR f*** SAKE FULLY SCHOOLED

READY TO START COMPETING

:rant:

 

[DavidH]

after all the debates,(imo only) looks like a good compromise would be48+ class,with the breeding restrictions. this would bring the weights down in the years to come,and cater for the odd large through backs in years to come. the 48+ class would have very few dogs as the breeding restrictions took hold, but they would be catered for.

sure folks would sponsor this class :thumbsup:

 

[weathergirls]

they could have a NO LIMIT class for anything over 55lb as additional racing no trophies just 100% payout

[as the old Fed had at the start when it was just no limit scr winner take all ]

 

[billyboy45]

pups 10 months to 14 months ,,,,sounds a better age to race them at,,,  :thumbsup:

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if this gets voted in we might see more dogs making it to the track.starting dogs at 6/7 month very chancie,so many pick up injurys that affect there racing career.

ask the people who check your dogs when a dog is ready to put behind a lure.

everybody have there ideas, one indication start them when the knuckle has gone as they are fully grown then. mine are h/ws started at 11 1/2month and 12 1/2 month. would think bentley will be similar.

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spot on david h :thumbsup: :thumbsup: :thumbsup:

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i personally think its up to the individual when they think their pups ready to run

think theres nothing wrong with the age limits now for puppies

what will it be called if voted in?

not the puppy championships surely 14months not a puppy

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mature puppy :thumbsup: why dont clubs put a capping age on putting pups behind a lure 8 month,still to early for me. when you hear pups screaming with fatal damage after schooling accident,a little bit of whippet racing dies in me. is this right NO.i know i am to careful with mine, but firstly they are our family pets. i.m.o

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Totaly agree here.Although i aint in the buisiness yet.Growth plates are still visible at 8 months.Only raced a pup of 8n1/2 months once.Sorryest thing i ever did,as she now has a slow take off,after doing a gacillus,trying to push her too hard,or too fast,getting her eady for another race 2 weeks later.Brian Jones,who is one of the top greyhound vets in Ireland,gave me a right talking too,and then went in to the whole muscle,bone,diaphram,heart,and lung stuff.I felt a right jerk after what he told,and showed me.Start em to yopung,end em to young,is what he say's.Mine were alway's 11n1/2 to 12 months old,before they even seen a lure,and will be from now on too.Reni had one 150yrd puppy run at 10,1/2 months,and aint seen a lure since.Do think though,that those with a lot of whippet in them,or pure whippets,especialy bitches,could go at 10,10n1/2 months.

 

[Paws123]

pups 10 months to 14 months ,,,,sounds a better age to race them at,,,  :thumbsup:

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if this gets voted in we might see more dogs making it to the track.starting dogs at 6/7 month very chancie,so many pick up injurys that affect there racing career.

ask the people who check your dogs when a dog is ready to put behind a lure.

everybody have there ideas, one indication start them when the knuckle has gone as they are fully grown then. mine are h/ws started at 11 1/2month and 12 1/2 month. would think bentley will be similar.

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spot on david h :thumbsup: :thumbsup: :thumbsup:

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i personally think its up to the individual when they think their pups ready to run

think theres nothing wrong with the age limits now for puppies

what will it be called if voted in?

not the puppy championships surely 14months not a puppy

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mature puppy :thumbsup: why dont clubs put a capping age on putting pups behind a lure 8 month,still to early for me. when you hear pups screaming with fatal damage after schooling accident,a little bit of whippet racing dies in me. is this right NO.i know i am to careful with mine, but firstly they are our family pets. i.m.o

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Totaly agree here.Although i aint in the buisiness yet.Growth plates are still visible at 8 months.Only raced a pup of 8n1/2 months once.Sorryest thing i ever did,as she now has a slow take off,after doing a gacillus,trying to push her too hard,or too fast,getting her eady for another race 2 weeks later.Brian Jones,who is one of the top greyhound vets in Ireland,gave me a right talking too,and then went in to the whole muscle,bone,diaphram,heart,and lung stuff.I felt a right jerk after what he told,and showed me.Start em to yopung,end em to young,is what he say's.Mine were alway's 11n1/2 to 12 months old,before they even seen a lure,and will be from now on too.Reni had one 150yrd puppy run at 10,1/2 months,and aint seen a lure since.Do think though,that those with a lot of whippet in them,or pure whippets,especialy bitches,could go at 10,10n1/2 months.

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to increase pups racing age did not get voted in billy

 

[wild whippies]

There are lots of reasons for not allowing ghds to run in the No Limit most of which don't hold water. However denise has pointed out a very good reason not to allow ghds to run, that is the racing of ghd comes under DEFRA and government legislation whereas whippet racing doesn't seem to at present.
Excluding ghds for this reason is sensible to protect the organisations from the legal and finacial implications of government legislation.

This unfortunatley means that No Limit racing also comes under scrutiny because I don't see how racing 60lb dogs, especially on ghd tracks ccould be defended as whippet racing if legal action was to be brought by DEFRA against any of the racing bodies. Only a small minority of whippet racers would consider some of the larger dogs in the No Limit as whippets I feel expert opinion would also rule these dogs as being ghds.

In view of the above then perhaps action does need to be taken to prevent what would reasonably be considered as ghd types running at whippet race meetings and as such new rules need to be drafted. However I feel it's important that racers already running are allowed to continue to race currently registed dogs.

As a template for debate I would suggest;

1) current registrants be allowed to run as before

2) Any dog over 56lb registered after 1st Jan 2009 will not be allowed to race.

3) Any dog over 40lb registered after 1st January 2009 with the ghd appearing more than once in a three generation pedigree not be allowed to race. Proof of pedigree to be provided via DNA testing at the owners expense if required

4) No ghds of any weight. Proof of parentage to be provided at the owners expense if required.

5) No parent unknown dogs allowed to run over 40lb

6) Dogs over 56lb to be excluded from the supreme scratch

7) From 2013 reduce the weight limits in points (2) and (6) to 48lb

The above rules would offer a reasonable amount of defence for whippet racing organisations against a charge of ghd racing contravening government legislation

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Good morning folks. Wish I'd of been able to attend the AGM but as many of you know neither I or Tony was able to with our move.

Anyway, the template from the above post was presented to the BWRA as suggestions on how a workable solution could be applied to satisfy the majority of racers. Because Tony wished to give them some leeway with regards to dates / weights, we stressed the above were not proposals so they could alter as they felt fit. His official proposal was that The BWRA addressed the current breeding patterns within whippet racing for the reasons he stated in his post. His comments did have merit as they were the voiced concerns of the BWRA Chairman at the begining of the proposals meeting.

However, because Tony didn't dictate all his suggestions as proposals, it wasn't used. Some suggested using parts of his suggestions, but I had to point out that if all the suggestions weren't used together, then it wouldn't be effective and I do believe one proposal alone wouldn't be either. The same situation, applies to drug testing, which I'll explain later.

There was many, many proposals to alter scratch racing / breeding so I think it's unfair to suggest that Mr Meades was alone in his opinion. Furthermore individuals voted as the felt fit.

Some felt that M.Mottrams proposal about implicating 'breeding rules' was the only change required, however as history has shown, we cannot rely on this solely and I voiced concerns that it would encourage individuals to lie about their breeding, which could be extremely detrimental to whippet racing.

With regards to voting, scratch racers have never been excluded from voting about handicap formats so I fail to see why they handicap racers should be excluded from voting. It most certainly does effect them as they're the ones breeding whippets who occasionally throw out a big one, which is what I thought scratch racing was supposed to accomodate, not those who want to breed greyhounds.

Regarding drug testing, I do believe the cost implication scared the pants off many, this was based on input given by L.Broom which was true based on HFL's future pricing. However, if A.Pockett's proposal of random testing had been took into consideration with this, the cost would of been substantially less whilst also being at it's most effective. All that would of been required really is to check with HFL whether they would accept samples obtained by a trained individual rather than a qualified professional, again bringing the costs down substantially.

I've also been informed that welfare of scratch dogs was mentioned as a concern. Personally, I recon there's more 15'lber's being rehomed now than there would be big dogs in the future if people bred appropiately. However, when your being told that the giant dogs are racing at flapping tracks and at lurcher events, you do tend to feel such comments are farsical. The other issue with welfare is not everyone has a ruthless attitude with their PETS (which is what they're supposed to be) many of us have dogs that aren't open class but we don't rehome them and I despise the idea that we have to have welfare officers to help these individuals rehome their inferior dogs. I feel it's meerly encouraging them to breed even more. :wacko:

I would be really interested to read any solutions critics could offer of how to sort out the breeding of whippet racing. There's many quick to criticise but none seem to offer workable solutions other than burying their heads in the sand and ignoring a problem that won't go away. Racers were warned and guided about their breeding patterns but they chose to ignore it, the sad thing is that because rules have had to be implicated, it effects some of those dogs that have been 'freak' big dogs which scratch racing was set out to accomodate.

 

[rodders]

Looks like Tony was the only one who thought about start dates for any of his suggestions Jac,do hope everybody takes this on board,when it comes to the next proposals year.I know I will :thumbsup:

 

[weathergirls]

I know for a fact the points regarding pups and bitches already in pup was raised at the reps/proposals meeting because I raised them myself

 

[marielou]

In the interests of clarity and to answer certain comments that I have heard about my having brought the breeding proposal forward I am putting up my proposal in full as it went to the reps meeting for consideration. Mine was not the only proposal on this subject but I did make it clear that it was for the reps meeting to consider and do with it what they want.They decided to only put forward a part of it which I have no problem with, its their job to represent our interests but I am a bit miffed that there has been inference that my proposal was some sort of ill thought out half measure. I also think we should wait for proper clarification from top table as to how the changes will be implemented.

So heres the full proposal, the bit in red is the bit that went forward to the membership.

Proposal for consideration by the BWRA committee and membership

Proposed changes to scratch racing

1) Change weight groups to up to 36lb, 40lb, 48lb and No limit

Reason:- As the weight groups stand at present dogs that are just in the no limit category ie 41lb are racing against dogs of sometimes more than 55lb, changing the weight groups would help to make the no limit racing safer.

2) Breeders to continue to outcross to greyhounds but after an outcross progeny may not be out crossed to another greyhound for two generations. This would be done by not allowing the registration of puppies for racing if they fall within these criteria. As with all things in whippet racing this would be dependent on the integrity of members.

Reasons: - This would address peoples concerns about what some see as excessive use of greyhound outcrosses but would still allow for the introduction of new lines. It would also help to gradually reduce some of the more extreme excesses in size and may help to promote the use of existing scratch stud dogs for those actively wishing to race in the scratch.

3) Introduce an over 60lb super heavy weight to be run in the bends season only to accommodate those members that don’t like straight racing and like to race big dogs on the bends. This would be additional racing with no championships or trophies and would in the long run probably disappear given proposals 1 and 2.

Reason: - This would address peoples concerns about safety when this small minority of large dogs competes in the no limit. If proposal 1 and 2 are successful this weight group would probably be able to be phased out but it would mean that no one would be excluded from racing if they have an out size pup.

This proposal is proposed by

Ms M L Mottram

As Ive said I have no problem with the committee only wanting to put forward a part of it for voting but it was never my intention that anyone should be excluded quite the opposite in fact.

Also I have no problem with trusting the integrity of my fellow racers to tell the truth, they are all the people I spend my free time with, why should I not trust them.

 

[sherry]

In the interests of clarity and to answer certain comments that I have heard about my having brought the breeding proposal forward I am putting up my proposal in full as it went to the reps meeting for consideration. Mine was not the only proposal on this subject but I did make it clear that it was for the reps meeting to consider and do with it what they want.They decided to only put forward a part of it which I have no problem with, its their job to represent our interests but I am a bit miffed that there has been inference that my proposal was some sort of ill thought out half measure. I also think we should wait for proper clarification from top table as to how the changes will be implemented.So heres the full proposal, the bit in red is the bit that went forward to the membership.

Proposal for consideration by the BWRA committee and membership

Proposed changes to scratch racing

1)  Change weight groups to up to 36lb, 40lb, 48lb and No limit

Reason:- As the weight groups stand at present dogs that are just in the no limit category ie 41lb are racing against dogs of sometimes more than 55lb, changing the weight groups would help to make the no limit racing safer.

2)  Breeders to continue to outcross to greyhounds but after an outcross progeny may not be out crossed to another greyhound for two generations. This would be done by not allowing the registration of puppies for racing if they fall within these criteria. As with all things in whippet racing this would be dependent on the integrity of members.

Reasons: - This would address peoples concerns about what some see as excessive use of greyhound outcrosses but would still allow for the introduction of new lines. It would also help to gradually reduce some of the more extreme excesses in size and may help to promote the use of existing scratch stud dogs for those actively wishing to race in the scratch.

3) Introduce an over 60lb super heavy weight to be run in the bends season only to accommodate those members that don’t like straight racing and like to race big dogs on the bends. This would be additional racing with no championships or trophies and would in the long run probably disappear given proposals 1 and 2.

Reason: - This would address peoples concerns about safety when this small minority of large dogs competes in the no limit. If proposal 1 and 2 are successful this weight group would probably be able to be phased out but it would mean that no one would be excluded from racing if they have an out size pup.

This proposal is proposed by

Ms M L Mottram

As Ive said I have no problem with the committee only wanting to put forward a part of it for voting but it was never my intention that anyone should be excluded quite the opposite in fact.

Also I have no problem with trusting the integrity of my fellow racers to tell the truth, they are all the people I spend my free time with, why should I not trust them.

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all seems like a very well thought out proposal marielou thanx for letting is know exactly wot u proposed

 

[tinarpoole]

FULLY AGREE WITH THE TOP TABLE OF THE BWRA NOT GETTING INTO DEBATE ON K9.BUT CAN WE GET SOME INDICATION WHEN CLARIFICATION OF THE NEW RULES WILL BE PUBLISHED.HAVE WE GOT TO WAIT FOR THE WHIPPET NEWS OR WILL WE BE INFORMED ON THE WEBSITE.THIS TOPIC IS CAUSING TROUBLE AND STUPID REPROCUSSIONS LIKE THE THREATS TOO DON AND RUTH.LETS PUT THIS TO BED AND GET THE MATTER RESOLVED.

 

[mutley]

well said rob :thumbsup:

 

[tinarpoole]

FULLY AGREE WITH THE TOP TABLE OF THE BWRA NOT GETTING INTO DEBATE ON K9.BUT CAN WE GET SOME INDICATION WHEN CLARIFICATION OF THE NEW RULES WILL BE PUBLISHED.HAVE WE GOT TO WAIT FOR THE WHIPPET NEWS OR WILL WE BE INFORMED ON THE WEBSITE.THIS TOPIC IS CAUSING TROUBLE AND STUPID REPROCUSSIONS LIKE THE THREATS TOO DON AND RUTH.LETS PUT THIS TO BED AND GET THE MATTER RESOLVED.

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COME ON BWRA WE ARE JUST ASKING WHEN CLARIFICATION WILL BE AVAILABLE NOT WHAT THE RULES ARE.THE MEMBERS HAVE A RIGHT TO KNOW.IF YOU CANT POST GET ON TO SOMEONE RESPECTED WHO CAN LIKE LINDA WINDLE.

 

[rodders]

FULLY AGREE WITH THE TOP TABLE OF THE BWRA NOT GETTING INTO DEBATE ON K9.BUT CAN WE GET SOME INDICATION WHEN CLARIFICATION OF THE NEW RULES WILL BE PUBLISHED.HAVE WE GOT TO WAIT FOR THE WHIPPET NEWS OR WILL WE BE INFORMED ON THE WEBSITE.THIS TOPIC IS CAUSING TROUBLE AND STUPID REPROCUSSIONS LIKE THE THREATS TOO DON AND RUTH.LETS PUT THIS TO BED AND GET THE MATTER RESOLVED.

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Cannot believe what I am reading 'threats to Don and Ruth' :rant: For someone to recieve threats for putting in a proposal that was carried by a MAJORITY vote of the membership is disgraceful.I voted against the capping,but to threaten someone because he disagrees with you Is the whole of the membership who voted for capping going to get threats too :wacko: It is called DEMOCRACY and i'm afraid if you cant live with it you shouldn't join a democratic organisation

 

[sharon whincop]

Has anyone phoned anyone from the top table and asked what the date it starts from. there no. are in the membership cards and I have always found its easier to find out first hand than wondering on here. Just a thought.

 

[Paws123]

FULLY AGREE WITH THE TOP TABLE OF THE BWRA NOT GETTING INTO DEBATE ON K9.BUT CAN WE GET SOME INDICATION WHEN CLARIFICATION OF THE NEW RULES WILL BE PUBLISHED.HAVE WE GOT TO WAIT FOR THE WHIPPET NEWS OR WILL WE BE INFORMED ON THE WEBSITE.THIS TOPIC IS CAUSING TROUBLE AND STUPID REPROCUSSIONS LIKE THE THREATS TOO DON AND RUTH.LETS PUT THIS TO BED AND GET THE MATTER RESOLVED.

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I second that ... especially now the BWRA web site is down till the new year

even if its a moderator that posts it the topic can be closed .. so no debate can be made on it

 

[rodders]

Think someone will have to phone someone off the top table.It was mentioned at the AGM that the commitee have been asked in the past not to comment on K9.That is possibly why you are not getting any answers.

 

[tinarpoole]

FULLY AGREE WITH THE TOP TABLE OF THE BWRA NOT GETTING INTO DEBATE ON K9.BUT CAN WE GET SOME INDICATION WHEN CLARIFICATION OF THE NEW RULES WILL BE PUBLISHED.HAVE WE GOT TO WAIT FOR THE WHIPPET NEWS OR WILL WE BE INFORMED ON THE WEBSITE.THIS TOPIC IS CAUSING TROUBLE AND STUPID REPROCUSSIONS LIKE THE THREATS TOO DON AND RUTH.LETS PUT THIS TO BED AND GET THE MATTER RESOLVED.

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IS THERE A PROBLEM DO THE BWRA NOT KNOW THERE OWN RULES CANT SOMEONE ANYBODY TELL A MODERATOR OR RESPECTED INDIVIDUAL OR PM ME WHEN WILL WE HEAR THE TIME SCALE OF THE NEW RULES WHATS THE SECRET.I ALWAYS FEEL THAT WHEN THERES SILENCE SOMETHING UNDERHAND IS GOING ON.BE TRANSPARENT FOR THE SAKE OF MEMBERS CONTINUED SUPPORT/